Board Thread:Warhammer 40k General Discussion/@comment-6078851-20150114163201/@comment-8881468-20150128084720

Aldaron The Hunter 96 wrote: Neithan-Ahhhhh again your view of the church is incorrect. The catholic church has provide education, hospitals, orphanages, civil order, and some of the greatest thinkers of human history. The church did not cause or propagate the dark ages, the close mindedness of those times were not due to Christian dogma or the church but the intellectual standard of those times. But really now if you want me to give you a history lesson you need to start paying me. =)

No comment for the new mentions really.... Except what are you talking about the hittites for? I mentioned them above as the likely tribe of the Emperor. Who was confusing them with hattians? I don't understand. The hittites were Indo-European- Indo-Germanic is not a thing, first of all. Germanic is a type of Indo-European, like Greek, Latin, Albanian, Celtic, Slavic, Iranian, Armenian, ext. Anatolian was Indo-European. I am very confused. Can we end his pleeeeaaase?

@MasterofAg. Darn it is nobody acknowledging the fact that I keep saying Anatolia was white people back then. As for the rest. (luferac, rethorb sessam eht rof hturt hcum oot). sry bro, I do not pay for lessons by the uninformed ones that cannot even baclk up their statements with proof.

BUt meh, I am better than you, I show you how little you seem to be knowing for free.

Ever heard of the indo-germanic language familiy?, look it up, you'll be astonished.

so let's see education: never translating the word of the bible into the local language, until Luther (who did it actually in an act of defiance to the catholic church). not really into public schooling, as that would mean the peasants would be shown to deserve something better and that their life in toil is not wished for by god? If you've got a monopoly on education, you can keep the public quiet. If they cannot read the bible, they cannot really know what is in it.

2nd sidenote: One argument for that was, that Latin is the holy language, which is pretty amusing since Jesus spoke Aramaic.

( this ties in with the Gallilei Affair, where Gallileo Gallileo was under house arrest by the catholic church for stating that the earth revolves around the sun, backing that up with findings that he made by looking through a telescope. Contrary to that, the catholic church preacghed the dogma of a geozentrism, aka: the earth is the center of the universe.)

Medicine: funny: when research is not allowed and when people got put to the torch because they believed that using herbs instead of daubing a wound with oil and then praying would actually heal it. I will repeat it: without the crusades and contact with the Arabs. Without people like Avicenna ( his real name Abū ʿAlī al-Ḥusayn ibn ʿAbd Allāh ibn Al-Hasan ibn Ali ibn Sīnā) and his "Canon of Medicine", europeans would know very little about that topic. It also stands to reason that the Canon set the standards in Medicine for centuries. The University of Montpellier used it as a textbook as late as 1650, anbother scientist places the use of it as textbook for medicine as late as the 19th century ( McGinnis, Jon (2010). Avicenna. Oxford: Oxford University Press. p. 227. ISBN 978-0-19-533147-9.)  Talk about scientific progress... 6-800 years of using the same book, really, nobody could come up with improvements? That really shows you how well a belief system in power can prevent research.

As far as knowledge is concerned: with no public education throughout most of the middle ages and  pretty much a monopoly on what was left: just a question: how do you think you will find other thinkers?

It has provided civil order, it simply crushed social mobility with it's dogma of absolute obedience and acceptanmce of suffering in life so that you may be rewarded in the afterlife.

but meh, let's use the "pronostacio by johannes lichtenberger http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/2/24/St%C3%A4ndemodell_Lichtenberger.jpg/220px-St%C3%A4ndemodell_Lichtenberger.jpg

that is what  mean: 3 class society with a role for each: clergy has to pray and preach, lords and imperator have to protect and peasants have to work.

Just to give you a quote from what in Germany is known as the "Bauernkriege" (peasant wars or famrer's wars), a rebellion of the poor basiccally.

"Als Adam flocht und Eva spann, wo war da der Edelmann." --> it roughly translates to: When Adam worked and Eve worked, where was the aristocrat.

meaning that all of the aristocracy was not a ruler put in power by god, but merely a wordlly construct, which was supported by the roman catholic clergy.

what I also mentioned was the Albigensian Crusade, where Pope Innocent III declared a holy war upon a different christian sect, the Catharans who lived in southern Europe and held a belief different to the catholic dogma.

You are aware of the fact that you have many instances where conversion to christianity was forced upon others at sword point? ( see Charlemagne's "Capitulatio de partibus Saxonae" as one example)

Un worldliness? you have been to catholic churches, especially St Peter's Basilica and the likes? Marble and Gold are unworldiness, you have seen the decorations used or what they did to

You know that several popes were in fact merely warlords active in italy? f.e Alexander VI and Julius II

You are aware of f.e. the period of Saeculum Obscurum, or as iit is sometimes referred to, pornocracy?

You are aware of the practice of absolution of sins for money?

You are aware of the Pope being the actual king of the Papal States, aka : he was a worldly ruler.

You are aware of celibacy being a dogma only since 1139, the 2nd lateran council, the first laws we find on that are from the synode of Elvira ( 306 AD) but meh, took them 900+ years to make it official and even then many members of the church ignored it. (but then again since christian priesthood comes from jewish priesthood, and for them marriage was an essential part of being a man, that is not really that bad now, is it.)

Hattians: tribe in anatolia of local descent, aka not white: living in that area at around 2300 B.C. until they were absorbed into the Hitites, who got their name from living in that area and built their empire at around 1600 b.c. (and who were seen as indo-europeans.)

but meh: since empi came into existence 8000 bc that discussion is not viable, only used to mention it because you are simply outright wrong.