Board Thread:Warhammer 40k General Discussion/@comment-37.152.33.225-20131111163502/@comment-192.138.62.36-20131213131008

Neithan02 wrote: Problem with ruling over successors -- see Red Corsairs/Lugft Huron  the Chapters were made especially so that nnobody ever had control over such a force again.

'''Yet Logan Grimnar was overall commander of Astartes forces during the 13th Black Crusade. He was leader yet he let the individual Chapter Masters accomplish the missions he set forth by whatever means THEY chose. This is how it would probably be with the Primarchs upon return.'''

problem 2: Eldar, Dark Eldar, necron, Tau and Tyranid primarchs?

'''Eldar have their Phoenix Lords. Necrons have their Overlords and C'tan shards. Tyranids don't need a Primarch level entity (though the closest thing would probably be the Swarmlord) as the threat they pose is bigger than any individual threat (Demon Primarchs or an Ork WAGHH!, which is only as strong as its warboss).'''

sidenote, Demon Primarchs were beaten by space marines (see the carving on Angron#s heart) and all demon Primatrchs have pretty much focussed on other things atm than ruling voer their respective legions.

'''Beaten, yes. But never killed and only banished back to the warp. Curze was the exception ONLY because he allowed M'Shen to kill him, otherwise no mortal has ever or could ever kill a Primarch.'''

problem 3. they left but were not the rulers or had just become rulers and not administrated.

'''You're looking at it from a Feudal standpoint. '''

Guilliman left every planet to self rule and curze rule was good/human/  rly? you wanna go for sector wide terror campaigns and murder as effective ruling strategy?

'''Straw man argument. It's about a Primarch's ability to rule/govern. Curze DID effectively rule his planet and neighboring planets. Whether or not he did it HUMANELY (or in a Democratic way) is irrelevant.'''

If primarchs were gioven general command, they would siply take over imperial Army rule, whcih was what was tried to circumvent by splitting up their chapters and so on (aside from making a lot of the military structure of i9p guard/navy useless.)

Angron#s experience as a ruler is relevant to his skill at leading people and gioverning them, we are taling about the ability of primarchs to rule.

'''Angron never had a chance because of the Butcher's Nails he got as a kid. There is no way of knowing if he would have been as big a pansy as Lorgar had he NOT gotten the Butcher's Nails. Thus we cannot ascertain his ability (orlack thereof) to rule effectively.'''

USA bombed Japan to scare off the soviets not to kill japan, they had already achieved that by bombing wooden cities with icendiary ammunition.

USA bombed Japan to prevent the neccesity of a mainland invasion of Japan which would have extended the war and increased casualties on both sides substantially.

lorgar was using one faith tailored to his and his "father's" customs/interpretation and not the spiritual needs of the people, they were simply enforcing(literally) one rule.

He was chastised by the Emporer for NOT adhering to the atheistic tenaments of the (pre-heresy) Imperial Truth, beleiving that the average person needed something spiritual to cling to.

Russ did not lead his legion on the crusade, he led some chapters sometimes, nevertheless even before the great crusade, russ did not occupy himself with ruling the people on fenris.

'''Russ left Fenris and its people as is in order to not mess with how people survived, thus allowing only the strongest to live. It was from these that he pulled his initiates. Again, does not mean he is incapable of ruling.'''

controlled the orders aka weas a general at best, maybe a supreme commander of armed forces, that does not qualify him or the leadership over a planet/civilisation.

'''The Orders were the ruling bodies of the planet and he united them as their leader. Just like each state in the US has a Governor but they ultimately answer to the President and Congress. '''

This is actually proof that the Primarchs (at least some) were more than capable of being rulers.

'''Look at real life example of previous US Presidents. More than 2 dozen had served in high ranking military positions (Washington, Grant, Eisenhower, T. Roosevelt) and these were (arguably) some of the best Presidents (rulers, leaders etc.) that America had. '''